"Loretta, spread me up another one of them baloney sandwiches!"

coal_miners_daughter03

Radio Station Dude: Come off that dumb hillbilly act!

Doolittle: If you knew Loretta, you’d know that ain’t no act.

Loretta: Thank you, honey.

I was a weird little kid so in a lot of aspects it makes perfect sense that I am as um…as eccentric as I am today. I didn’t go outside and play much because honestly the neighborhood kids thought I was a freak…because I was. I was so much younger than all the kids in my school classes so we were on different maturity and social levels. (Plus they were all fucking stupid…yes Nikki Leppard where ever you are today, I am talking about you.) I loved to hang out with Momma Ballou while she listened to her records, read as many library books as they would let me check out at one time, and watch hours and hours of television. Records, books, and music have always been my best friends. I was obsessed with television and to tell you the truth I still am. Back in the day we didn’t have as many mind numbingly fantastic reality shows and cable channels as we do now but we did have a VCR! I have written in the past about how much of an impact the movie Urban Cowboy had on my life but another video tape that I remember watching 3849382492389 times as a kid was Coal Miner’s Daughter.

.

I know you peeps are thinking what the hell is Rita rambling about today, but stay with me here…it will all come back around, I swear.

I have always tried to be a good “fan” in the past and I can’t help but be passionate about doing everything I could to support my favorite artists. Looking back now I can see how people could and DID look at this behavior just like Nikki Leppard did when I was 10 and think what a freak! To be honest, looking back I might even be a little embarrassed about my enthusiasm but no matter HOW jaded I am becoming about the “business” or the fans of this scene, I still think that as a fan when a particular song, album, or artist touches you it is almost your obligation to do whatever you can do to thank them. I always thought the best way to do that was to spread the word as much as possible about their music and hope that people get it as much as you did and do the same. Don’t get me wrong, I am not suggesting that everyone should be a wackadoodle like I am, but I have always been a person to do things to the extreme or do nothing at all. I am an “all or nothing” kinda gal and that is just my nature. (I think the mental health professionals have a name for that, just ask Patty Duke but I AIN’T that bad!)

I have joined Fan Clubs and Street Teams for a few Nashville artists in the past and as a member of those groups the whole purpose was to be active on message boards and websites by doing the mass email mail outs, the calling of the radio stations request lines, writing music publications. The point was to “spread the word” via MySpace, etc. to promote the singles, records, and artists in general.

(PLEASE remind me do to a blog one day about the REAL fucking CRAZY people out there in those circles! I may be insane but I ain’t mentally unstable!)

I did this because it was kinda fun, because it made me feel like I belonged to something bigger, and because I guess deep down I felt like it would or could make a difference. Since I have long left the “Nashville” realm for the Red Dirt scene, I haven’t really done any of these things on that type of organized level. If I love a song or an artist I just make copies of their cd’s and mail them to my friends or rattle on about a show on my Facebook page.

I know, I know this isn’t some busted up episode of “This is Your Life Rita”, so seriously STAY WITH ME…

Loretta: I’m gettin’ so sick of baloney.

Doolittle: You are? Well, you know what they say about eatin’ baloney, don’t you?

Loretta: No, what?

Doolittle: Makes you horny.

Loretta: What does that mean?

Doolittle: Are you so dadburn ignorant you don’t know what horny means?

Please tell me this dialogue rings a bell because it’s from Coal Miners Daughter. Long story short…Loretta was the shit and her husband Doo believed in her and her abilities. She recorded a song she wrote herself and Doo stayed up night and day mailing shit tons of her record to every radio station in the country. When that didn’t seem to work, Doo and Lorettie left their 128 kids at her momma’s house and they hit the road. They personally walked up into these radio stations, met the DJ’s, told them their story and basically pitched a walleyed hissy fit until the DJs agreed to play the song on the radio.

Loretta: Shoot, we’ve been driving so much, I don’t know where I am half the time. But it’s fun. We sing, and talk, and Doo – that’s my husband – he’ll get to acting horny.

DJ: What!

Loretta: And the more I laugh, the hornier he gets, and then he’ll say, “Loretta, spread me up another one of them baloney sandwiches!”

The song was so good that people loved it and started to call and request to hear it again and again and again. Doo and Loretta didn’t have a clue what they were doing until one day after enough baloney sammaches, Loretta’s song was #14 on the Billboard Chart and she were invited to play on the Grand Old Opry.

Taaaadaaaahhhh!

Pffft people…don’t you see how easy it is? Quit all the crying and whining? Just write a good song, send it to a radio station, ask the DJ to play it, people love it, and all of a sudden you are a big famous star! How friggin hard can that be? It worked for Loretta!

Wait, what do you mean it doesn’t really work that way? Apparently not so much.

Last week I was in my car being force fed endless shitty fucking music from Rascal Flatts and Taylor Swift and I had a little Fan Club/Street Team flashback. I thought to myself, self you love the new Sunny Sweeney song “From a Table Away” and think it really needs to be played on the radio…call and request it! So I did. (Please realize again that, I am naive and the radio station I called doesn’t play Texas Country Music because I don’t really have one of those stations around my area, but that shouldn’t matter because a good song is a good song, right?)

The kid that answered the request line basically laughed at me when I refused to take “we don’t have that song and if we did we couldn’t play it” for an answer and trust me, I argue with people for a living and I LOVE to argue. I had the poor kid on the phone for over a half hour. The situation at this radio station was different because of their “company” but I did luck out because he was a Texas Country Music fan and he gave me quite an earful of how “things” work…

Now, do I know if this dude knew what he was talking about? Nope. Not one bit, but I’m just telling you what I was told. In a nutshell “our” artists that can afford to do it hire a “radio promoter”…and they don’t come cheap! These promoters know their shit and have longstanding relationships with these radio peeps so they send the songs to all the stations and ask them to play it on the radio. The more the songs are played the higher they place on the charts. (I reckon that explains the mystery as to why so many people I have never heard of in my life are on the Texas Music Charts!)

I am positive there is much MORE to this scenario because there has to be other ways to get songs played, right? I know none of this shit is a secret, but I just gotta know for my own piece of mind if fans calling the radio stations over and over to request a song really makes a difference or does it just annoy the fuck out of radio djs?

I ain’t trying to Woodward and Bernstein up any type of shitstorm, but I just gotta know if all those Facebook and Twitter “Call your radio station and request our new song blah blah blah” updates are really necessary? Should we even bother to call and request the songs we want to hear or are the paid radio promoters basically deciding what it is we get to hear on Texas radio? I ain’t accusing, I am just asking because now I am curious.

Bottom line…

If you are in the Texas Music scene and don’t suck, can you promote yourself like Doolittle and Loretta did and actually be successful or is it like The Hag sang…”It’s all in the movies”?

-Rb

Loretta: “I may be ignorant, but I ain’t stupid!”


^^Dewey’s First Bath picture…just because!^^

133 Comments

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    You got it..I tried to promote my music, call, visit the stations and it got nowhere hired a song pusher and now I have had several songs on the TX Music Chart it's just the way it is I guess..

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Rita you hit the nail on the head sister. Its nothing but good old fashioned payola but instead of paying the dj's you pay the dj's buddies and those buddies do them favors aka get their clients to perform at the gigs the station's sponsors. Welcome to the underbelly girl.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    As a radio person, I would love to hear someone call and request a song. I may play the request or I may not, but at least I know someone else other than me I listening and cares about the music. Sadly, nobody ever calls me about the music except this crazy old man who says I don't play enough Roger Miller and Hank Thmpson (I say that because after he told me that he proceeded to talk my ear off about the lost city of Atlantis and Edgar Casey). If I get a lot of calls on a partcular song, I do have to try to judge if it is legitamite interest or a bunch of superfans on a mission.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Roger Miller Fan

    I think you answered the question. Even if it is a bunch of superfans if the dj doesn't want to play the song, he doesn't. So don't waste your time calling.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    tiblade07

    To answer the direct question. Is it worth calling a request? No not really. Unless your requesting something in the rotation. Other than that good luck. If you go to the Texas Music Chart, and read the under write you can pretty much tell whom is pushing who. It's all just part of the game.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    payloa 2010. it sickens me that there is even such a job in this market or scene for radio promoters. this music was supposed to be different and raw. but, instead it is just as bad as the mainstream alternative. another bonus point for rft. at least they play what people actually request even if it is crap.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Rita rita Rita.

    Sweetie, it's a business. Period.

    Just like in any field there are good promos and shady promos but in the end it is all about money.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Sad State of Texas Music and no one Cares

    Calling does no good. If you want to actually REQUEST something and HEAR it, then Radio Free Texas is your only option.

    Oh, but RFT sucks right? They play anyone!

    Exactly. You can't have your cake and eat it too. People blast RFT, but in fact they are the only true ALL REQUEST situation out there in our scene.

    So do you want the pushers to decide for you, or do you want to decide for yourself? Based off the results and the comments here, I'd say RFT is losing.

    Kinda like the Mexicans who SAY they want change and want corruption out of the system, but then when they actually go vote, they vote for the crooked guy. Turns out, it is fun to SAY the right thing, but when it comes down to it, the crooked, corrupt system of paying off cops makes your life better.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    On Top of the World

    As it was once explained to me, they only play what's on the Top 20, it's mostly pre-programmed computer garbage and they don't even actually see the hard copies any longer. So if your artist is on a MAJOR label(Ragweed) and that label doesn't feel the need to push you because let's say they have a bigger artist on the roster, then off you go on your own. Now if the artist does a duet with a more famous artist (Ragweed) then, more exposure because of the high ranking artists.

    I used to push for Rhett Akins like crazy, one because I knew him, two because he's uber talented and three because he came out when Chesney came out and he was far better looking. Then I discovered Rhett would rather hunt than perform & write rather than take the stage. Now he's the co-writer to a dozen songs this year that have been in the top 10. He should be the singer to those songs. Ask Blake Shelton and his "Kiss My Country Ass".

    I'm far too passionate about my music & the business and those I like/love I would love to hear & see in the world. It's a shame that the labels don't push for what they sign & pay for.
    FU*K

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Nikki Lepper

    Fuck your freak ass Rita.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Nikki Lepper is a Cunt

    Dear Nikki,
    I'm mailing Rita the video tapes and the still shots of all the weird fuckin we did. I'll make sure she gets the shot of you with your finger up your ass, gritting your teeth and asking me to choke you. FREAK. You remember those nights? You remember where you put that Boone's Farm bottle?
    Well, bitch, you will soon. I only pray that Rita posts a couple of the stills–PLEASE RITA!!
    You shouldn't have keyed my truck or given me crabs. Whore.
    Good luck explaining that to your husband–the photos are time stamped:)

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    This is one of the best blogs you have written so far Rita!! PROPS to you darlin'. With that said… I absolutely LOVE Sunny Sweeney and her new song

    FYI DJ Stu Stewart at the Ranch Fort Worth will play your request. If its in our scene and he can somehow get it he'll play it! But for some odd reason he lost his time slot and is now a back up DJ hmmm sound fishy to you? Cause it does to me!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Tori

    It truly is sad that the scene we love has come to this. There are too many "music snobs" out there telling us what is good and what isn't, because their opinion is OBVIOUSLY more important than mine or any other fans.
    The only way I can make sure I get to listen to good music is to take my happy ass to the concerts when they are in town. I know I'm not going to hear anything good on the radio stations in this area!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Gallie Kaston WINS BIG

    write gerry@theranchradio.com and tell him how bad he fuckin sucks for his dirty dirty gestapo tactics to get your song on the air–it wasn't that way when that midget with the hairdo that Gallie Kaston used to work for ran shit. But, sadly, Gallie got run for boosting prize packs and riggin shit–allegedly. Now she controls all of Stragglerdom–Gallie WINS!!!!!

    Its a dirty business. FUCK YOU GERRY

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    I think the people who really "get it" when it comes to music really want to believe in mankind. We want to believe that great songwriters and great singers and great performers win out in the end. We want other people to hear what we hear and feel what we feel.

    But in the end, like some of the comments above revealed, its all about the $$$………..So when one of "our" artists gets fed up with the system, and goes to get a big label, we call them a sell out……. vicious cycle!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Back in the day, PD's and MD's made decisions based on what their listeners wanted. Then record labels and promoters started wining and dining them and paying them to go on trips to get them to play their music which is called payola.

    We have to get back to the days of old. PD's and MD's have to stop taking the calls of the promoters. Go with what your market wants. Not what the radio promoter promises you. If we get rid of the promoter, is it safe to say that the good bands would have a fair chance at getting their song on radio? It brings more merit to an actual band/song vs a promoter getting whatever they were paid money to get on radio.

    If it was good enough for Loretta, it's good enough for Pudding Pop, Umpa Lumpa Kyle Park and others.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    just on a regional level(TX Chart) a radio promoter cost between $3500-$5000 for 14-16 weeks to push one single and one single has to be followed up by another and another well u get my point it's expensive! Wish it was like the movies..

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    At this point, promoters are deciding what we should hear. That same promoter can call a PD, and tell them that they will get the "x band" single early, or some special prize pack from the bigger band, if they give spins to the smaller band they are pushing. Bands have to save up a TON to pay for radio promoters *coughmostare$4kpersinglecough* in hopes that they get spins or hit the Texas Music Chart. And if that band doesn't have that much money (which a ton of the smaller bands don't) then they just sit and don't have a song on the radio.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Spin My Shit

    http://www.windingroadmusic.com

    If you want spins–look it up

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    10 of the 50 songs on the chart are Winding Road. 7 of the 50 are Smith Entertainment (another distribution company). The rest are either big labels (Universal, etc) or an independent radio promoter.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    APEX out of Nasvhille has the best track record w/the TX DJ's and dedicate more time w/out pushing 5 guys at the same time cough cough Winding Road…..

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    1207 is a jackass

    hey 1207–if the band was worth a shit they could earn enough to save enough to pay the promoter—don't put your sob story off on us like promoters are bad.

    Get a piggy bank–fuckass

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Nice try to gain business Winding Road and APEX….people aren't dumb, putting something anon as if you didn't work for those companies just makes you look unprofessional.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    12:29 – why don't you pull $4k out of your ass right now so you can get some radio spins. As you try to pay for your band, and other expenses and merch, etc. Doesn't matter if the band is worth a shit. Go look at the chart and tell me HONESTLY how many of those bands are worth a shit? Half of them don't even tour. It's all about the money, not the band. Nice try–fuckass

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    1232 is a MORON

    Dipshit 1232–

    If you WANT to succeed you find a way. If you want to sit around scratching your balls, smoking shitty schwag and blaming everyone else then do that. Promoters can get away with charging 4grand because the money comes back in the form of ticket sales, merch etc.
    IT DOES matter if the band is worth a shit–you think a guy that charges 4 grand per song is gonna take on just any swinging dick–fuck no–they take on what they can be proud of.

    PLUS, look at this, are you trying to tell me the bands on this chart aren't worth a shit? Get serious…http://www.texasmusicchart.com/Pages/Chart.htm

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Who set the bar at the avg of 4 Thousand Dollars?

    Did every promoter start to ratchet up their price in small increments to see what the market would handle and this is where we sit?

    Why can't it come down?

    I realize 4k to the larger artists really isn't a drop in the pan, but what if every artist refused to pay that price?

    What if the artists themselves drove the price down?

    The promoters only have a job because the TMC exists. Without it they would have NO JOB.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Shanada

    Just go play live. Have fun, enjoy what you do. Have a drink or 12 and play tweet funs with someone, Everyone seems so fucking serious. This job/industry is supposed to be FUN – whether you're a fan or an artist. NO ONE in this scene is ever going to be huge to the mainstream, so just dig what you've got. Screw work, I'm going to happy hour.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    1240 is a radio promoter

    12:40 – I did look at the chart. I sure do bet Kelly Kenning, Jake Kellen, Phil Hamilton and the Backroads Drifters, JB and the Moonshine Band, Brian Milson, Justin Haigh, Jolie Holliday, Clint Martin and Backseat Molly are EASILY making back their $4k in ticket sales and merch. Dumbass. Nice point, just fucking blown up. Go back to calling radio stations and trying to prove you are worth $4k.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    The music or the band worth a shit? We work with Apex out of necessity. If you put out the bet thing written in 2010, which we did btw, and nobody listens what's the point? Again it's all just part of the game. Love it or leave it. You have to be clinically insane to want a career in the music biz anyway. Thank baby jezzus we are…..

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Agreed--1232 IS a MORON

    1232 you are right it IS about the money and the GOOD bands make it. Put the bong down, go practice, save your lil pennies, make a record, hire a promoter and make some cash–what's so hard to understand about that?

    Dipshit

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Hungry drummer

    Shanada you can say that cause you can afford the drinks. I can't even afford the bolonga sandwich!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    anon 12:40 – you cannot say it helps ticket sales from every station that reports…that's such crap. There are so many stations out there that don't even have VENUES in their area. Weak, but nice scramble.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Shanada is AWESOME

    OHHHHHHHHHH SHANADAAAAA, you lil scorcher you. Thanks for being the voice of reason, as always, now get off this blog and go pimp Matt King–that dude rocks.

    Also, 1243 is a genuis, no chart, no job. Thanks Katie Key

    1246–I don't work anywhere close to radio or promotion. How bout you take a look at the top half of that chart. Also , I noticed you didn't mention the WORST payola, DJ bribing, scumbag in the entire STATE, Jerry Audley. That guy has never played a song he didn't buy and I'd wager your left nut that the VAST majority of his spins come from the equally scummy KHYI The Range, which is run by everyones favorite embezzler, Yoshua Yones

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Been listening to KHYI out of Dallas for 10 years now, they do promo spots stating they are the only no-Yankee owned station in the metroplex and I reckon they play whatever fag boy Josh Jones (station owners son) wants to here, much much better when Bruce Kidder was there but, they still play shit you won't here anywhere else……Bruce Dillon has got to be hands down the best DJ in this genre…….Allen Peck is old and corny but dang he is such a nice guy in person, and is a living Radio Legend.
    That guy you plugged over on the other blog.. * Lefsetz Letter addressed this issue often, however if he came down here and attended some live shows he would realize the shit he bitchs about so much is non existent in Texas/Red Dirt.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Shanada is AWESOME – I never said anything about the top half of the chart. Those bands/artists are good, and do deserve to be there. BUT, they also can easily afford $4k w/o even batting an eye. That wasn't really my point, good bands do make the chart and get a ton of spins. They deserve to. But for the smaller bands, they spend their very last dime (or bands that don't tour or anything but have a TON of money) to hit the bottom half of the chart. What does that get them? An opening gig for the top half of the chart. Maybe radio promoters should do a sliding tier on payment? If you hit the chart, you pay "x", if you hit in the top 20 you pay more, if you hit top 10..etc etc. That might be fair? Then everyone is driven to work harder?

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Finally a valid reason for Bangela the Troll to hate you Rita.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    103. KRZY

    103–I understand you a little better and in all seriousness–why should anyone drop a price for anything? I'm not trying to be a shit, I'm asking. Socialism in Texas Music? The strongest survive baby and that means in every way. Why should a promoter help you by charging less?

    I'm confused and do not understand this concept at all. When your band makes it, are you going to charge a little venue less because they are 'really good' and their customers deserve to see you too? You gonna turn down 10k to play for $500 because a venue you don't know 'deserves' you?

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Four Thousand Up In Smoke?

    Go download the list of reporters, then go to every one of them with a CD in hand, a box of donuts, shake some hands, and they will spin you. Promoters not needed if you want a hit in Texas. Ass kissing is all you need.

    Just putting out a great single or having a great band means nothing relative to the Texas Music Chart.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Agreed on the sliding scale. Work for your 4k – not force an artist to pay the 4k up front and then if you can't get it very high blame it back on the artist.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Katie Key

    anon 12:59….you bring up a point I ask all the time especially when I hear how our radio reporters are harrassed ALL the TIME by promoters to play crappy music: "What would we do without the chart?"

    Yeah I wouldn't have a job…and that would suck and I'd have to go flip burgers somewhere…but seriously, has it gotten too mainstream?

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    There is not a single promoter int he business in Texas with the balls to do a sliding scale of pay.

    Who in their right mind would go along with "Results = $$$?"

    No one. They want money, and then hope for the best.

    Earning it would be nice to see.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    I really wish artists/bands would come on today and post their real name and tell us how THEY feel about it. We need to get the opinion of the ones paying the money. Interesting blog today Rita, the comments have been great, and finally a debate again! Nice work.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    It would take ONE promoter with the balls to do that and it would start to force the change within the business of promotion.

    Bands would quickly want to go to the promoter that had a sliding scale. Once that promoter was too busy to take on any more songs then one would think that artists would demand it from the rest of the field.

    If you want our business you have to earn it.

    Base pay and then a bonus structure for the various spots it hit on the chart. Top 50 – 500 extra dollars, Top 30 add 500 more, Top 20 etc.

    Once you hit the top 10 you're at the 4k but you EARNED it.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    y'all high

    YOU ARE ALL LIVING IN A PIPE DREAM!!!! PUT THE PIPE DOWN!!!!!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Artist who can afford three thousand and more "It is a perfectly good system. I like how it keeps the up and coming bands out of my way and further separates the haves from the have-nots."

    Artist who is no where near being able to afford three thousand dollars yet, "If I sell the van, and convince the band to work for free for three weeks, we can get a single on the radio and maybe get our name on the Texas Music Chart. Then we can book a show for more than $250. It is going to be so awesome. We will all eat four times a week and buy some clean underwear. Things are really looking up."

    It would be better if you could buy your way into the clique with $3000, because until you are accepted by the clique, you aren't going anywhere but broke.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Germy fan

    I'm just a ghermy little radio calling fan too but help me. Am I reading this correctly?

    Bands pay someone $5000 bucks to call and email radio stations to play their song and as a fan I've been doing this for free? How do I get this job? What do the radio stations get in return from these promoters? Why do they just do what they say? Is it just a good buddy system because for 5 grand I'll call every radio dj on the map and even throw in a handjob.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    The Texas music chart is all make believe! The radio people can say they played a song 6 times an hour when they didn't and there is no one that can prove they did or didn't.

    Can we go back to talking about whores?

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    EXACTLY – 5000 times X number of artists. So you can work 5 artists in ONE 25 min phone call once per week. for that 25 min phone call or email you just made a nice chunk of change.

    The radio promotion system is backwards. Instead of radio promoters going out and seeking out bands/songs to work that they "believe in" as a promoter above said they sit there and wait and 25 bands hit them up and they are allowed to name a high price and pick and choose who they want to work – who will pay the price – not who they necessarily believe in.

    Agree with the sliding scale – make your money the proof in the pudding so to speak and the ship will be righted.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Katie Key

    anon 1:34 we can only compile what we are given and hope the radio stations are telling the truth.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    "even throw in a handjob."

    Post a picture. If you are hot, we will talk.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    My head is spinning. Was this not the entire reason why we all started chanting Fuck Nasville in the first place? When the Red Dirt Revolution started didn't we all take pride in the fact that our music wasn't played on the radio? All I can say is support live music!

    Shannon, I have to know. Have you ever paid a radio promoter?

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    The chart isn't doing anything wrong, so Katie can step back and say, "We only compile what they give us."

    BUT, Katie knows the BS game of how you get on the chart as well as anyone. And she could not keep a straight face and say it is talent.

    There are ZERO people on the chart who are there because they are so good that fans just organically make that happen. They ALL have a promoter running it for them.

    So yes, your fan based phone calls are useless.

    Sorry people, but that is the ugly truth. Your favorite upstart local band has no shot until a rich uncle dies.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Shanada is right. The whole radio system is pointless. Get a good live show and the good word of mouth will do wonders. Ragweed and many others got a big following and then some slight nudges from radio like the wolf playing a song or 2. But, for the most part it was the buzz of the live show. This radio stuff is just another sleazy way for people to leech off the musicians. No better than booking agents, but at least booking agents provide a useful service.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Who do the promotors work for? Do they work for the record label? Do they work for the band managers? Are the independant? I'm very confused. Do Nashville artists have these people?

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Katie Key

    Anon 1:45 I NEVER said it's all talent based. I KNOW how the game is played and DO NOT agree with it one bit. So how do you change it?

    And why are there so few people willing to state who they are on here? Man/Woman up and let us know who you are.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Hippie

    I love Phish and Widespread Panic. Never heard them on the radio, but they can outdraw every band on these fake ass charts.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Don't you lazy fucks start bashing on Katie again. She has done alot for this scene and I can bet she doesn't make the money these scum sucking promoters make from fucking over bands!!!!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    On Top of the World

    Phish is a Cultural Phenomenon like the Dead. That's not a comparasion that you can afford to make. We're talking standard issue bands. Not jam bands that play for 3 1/2 hours and part of their requirements are mushrooms or some spirit of the mind.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    from everything i have heard promoters are paid by the artists on the tx level.

    now sometimes if you have a deal with smith or winding road they will provide the promotion for free. not sure how hard they work for free though.

    and the large large artists who have real labels might have the label pay for it

    regardless it comes out of the artists pocket one way or another.

    if the label pays for it, you can bet your ass they will tack it onto what they will get back from you before they pay you royalties and such from cd sales.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Why not skip the promoter and just pay the intern whose job it is to fill out the paper they send the radio station.

    And Doolittle was a pimp.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Shanada

    Radio promotions can work for some artists – it really depends what they do. I, personally, think it's better for mainstream and not this scene. If you're a touring band (which I feel should be a prerequisite for being a band at all) just go visit the station that's in the town where you're playing. Invite the dj/pd/md/whoever to the show. Prove yourself. If they like it they'll play it. If they don't, move on.

    Most major labels have in house radio promotions, but the artist still ends up paying through the nose through recoup charges. There are great folks out there in radio land don't get me wrong. I consider many of them very close friends. Katie and her team have done great things by simply giving artists a goal. How they achieve that goal is their own choice to make. The guys at APEX do a great job as well, it really just depends on the band. Ragweed – not a radio friendly band. Seth James and Randy Rogers – radio bands. Neither is better, they're just different.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Shanada is AWESOME

    OHHHHHHHH SHANADAAAAAA!!! I loves me some Shanadian perspective. God Bless you ma'am, thanks so much for giving us your considered opinion and advice.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Shanadian Anthem

    Shanada has an anthem!!!!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Why do you all love shanada but hate Melinda? Both coldhearted Yokos!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    If you want to see a DJ/PD who still does things the right way, go talk to Shayne Hollinger. He is to be the PD/MD at Mandatory FM in Stephenville and now he is on The Ranch in Fort Worth.

    Mandatory FM was the best damn radio station in Texas and they handled the music the right way. If it was good, it got played, no matter who called or e-mailed or gave handjobs. If it sucked, it sucked, and the CD got used as a fucking coaster.

    This is why bands/artists have such respect for Shayne and the Hollinger family, because they know music and they know the business. You never heard a single Donadouche or Puddin' song Mandatory from day 1, I promise you that!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    I agree that mandatory fm was the shizzznet but how'd that work out?

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Maybe you didn't here Puddin on Mandatory FM. They were pretty much exclusively Americana for one thing.

    But news flash for you. Puddin is probably the next biggest thing in our state scene.

    He is not too far from being at the top of the Texas game.

    No he isn't in the old school clique yet, but he is closer than anyone else.

    Mandatory was playing more and more Americana music all the time. And that is great. But not playing Texas Music like Watson, Kyle Park, Puddin is not because they suck. It was because they were not Americana

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Easton Santos

    I would love to say that it doesn't matter what radio station it is, that as long as the music is good (as I set here listening to Texas Renegade asking myself why they aren't getting more support out of our Texas stations) they will play it… Its simply not true, In our years of business its been a struggle to balance the record reps "request" and the actual talent of the artist and the music. That being said; if you do come across a doesn't radio station (959 The Ranch, Texas Music World.com, 947 Badlands FM :) that will play the artist that make the listeners happy instead of simply what makes the reps happy well your lucky… not to call out anyone (Clear Channel or Cox Media) but there are not near as many stations in Texas hell the Country for that matter that actually care enough anymore to actually put froward the effort in their music anymore!

    Easton / TexasMusicWorld.com / 947 Badlands FM Corpus Christi

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Hey Easton, aren't you promoting some people on the side for money, too? Seems like a conflict of interest.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Shanada

    We were in Port A on vacation and heard 94.7 play Aaron Watson, Wade Bowen and then Grateful Dead – in THAT order – bad ass. It would be a more level playing field if ALL dj's could still play what they wanted to play.

    And don't worry anon 2:50, plenty of people do.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Puddin ain't so bad. He just needs to check his ego at the door.

    Define what the "next big thing" means. Does that mean a fat Nashville deal? Does that mean played on Clear Channel or does that mean headlining your own festival or selling out Billy Bobs?

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    She a cold hearted yoko in love with a meal ticket man.

    Let's all sing along!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    I never have quite understood why a small band trying to get recognized has a manager and a promoter for $4,000. Seems like the manager, who is paid by a % from the gigs, would want to get off their rears and promote the artist themselves…this would put more money in their own pocket because the artist would be booked more often and possibly have bigger venues if their songs were heard on the radio. Plus the manager would pretty much know how the public reacts to the artist song…please tell me why these artists have both a manager and a promoter?

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Shanada

    If, by meal ticket man, you mean that I get free corn dogs – you're right on.

    I'm out.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    3:23 – valid question. But do you work and have a job? While doing that job, go call 70+ radio stations every week (during their call times, not when YOU want to call them) and see how well you juggle that. A good manager doesn't have the time in a week to continuously call/email/text/visit radio stations. Plus, PD's don't want to be bothered by managers and bands, they want to hear from the promoters and knock out 6 bands in one call.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    TP

    Hey Katie, I'll tell you a little about what I am trying to do.

    This is long, so spare me the lecture and skip it if your name isn't Katie, or if you just don't care. 8)

    I am involved with a program that is trying to help young artists. We are a 503C non-profit organization who is trying to give some of the younger up-and-coming type guys a chance at some things they otherwise couldn't afford.

    We are using our network to help them get quality records cut/mastered. We are using our network to help them do things like replace stolen equipment, get a little support from some clothing sponsors, drink sponsors, trying to get venues to give these guys a shot on a significant night rather than throwing them a Tuesday night slot or a cancellation last minute.

    We are making some headway, but it is a really long and uphill battle because fans are not currently interested in supporting many of these kids (they aren't all kids by the way).

    Some of these bands need management, they all need booking agents, they all need publicity, they all need radio support.

    The point is, we need support from people who matter in our scene to make it all work. SOMEONE has to develop the next thing.

    I have said this to many people and I still believe it is true. There is a top tier, and it holds a few select artists, and then the next level is miles behind it. There is no middle ground really.

    I make my living because the scene exists. I don't make a living because of one particular artist or band. So it is naturally in MY best interest to build and support the scene. No scene, no one to take pictures of, or manage, or hang out with, no one to sell a magazine to, or whatever. In other words, no job.

    So that is what our program is partially about. Someone has to develop young acts and give them a real shot at being seen/heard/noticed.

    To grow and succeed in a Ragweed way is not really possible right now in this scene. There are lots more bands out there, and the barriers to entry are much different as well. We aren't breaking new ground anymore for the most part, and that creates a different kind of momentum/timing situation that can't be replicated at the moment.

    In my opinion, if we truly cherish the scene, we have to be more vigilant and supportive as FANS, as other artists (especially the ones who already made it), as radio, as venues…etc.

    The whole scene needs somewhat of a reality check, and start to work together to help bring up the next round. There used to be tons of support for the younger artists in this scene. Everyone wanted everyone else to succeed. Now it is very competitive and very vicious as we can see from the anonymous industry folks posting here.

    So our organization is going to keep trying to raise money and support to help our artists succeed, or at least have opportunities. And we can't help everyone alone, but we can help a few at a time. We have already helped a few who are pretty successful already.

    And we have some good friends in this business who ARE supporting our program, and hopefully we can start to see that pay off before long.

    We need all the help we can muster for sure.

    We aren't specifically asking for support for any artist in particular. We are looking for support for the concept and the program, and through that, we will help artists along.

    I could name many artists who I think are awesome and aren't getting much real support or push.

    Maybe there are just too many options now for anyone to gain a groundswell of support that gives them the momentum to drive on?

    The fact is, there is no machine willing to develop and work with people in this scene unless there is short term $$ gain from it. That is what we are trying to take out of the equation in our program. We are taking a philanthropic approach to it. And we hope some people recognize the purpose of what we are doing and help us out. In our discussions thus far, people have been more than willing to help.

    TP

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Katie Key

    TP that sounds like something I would LOVE to be involved with. Let's talk!

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    TP

    Crap. It told me that my post was too long, so I took out tons of the good stuff. And then I think I double posted. What a mess.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Rita Ballou

    Todd…

    I have a bit of a background doing 50C3 stuff from my years with the state. I'm know I'm not in the scene or anything but let me know too if I can help. I recently asked the bhb's if I could voulnteer at some of their events after I saw what great stuff was done with WB's charity thingy but was told no thanks because I was too controversial. :( I didn't know anyone was too controversial to donate time and effort to charity and I again cried and ate a bag of cheese puffs but if you aren't scared to be associated with me, holler at a ho.

    And Shanada I'll bring the corndogs to Thanksgiving this year!

    Well today was interesting and educational. I just wanted to know if I should request my favorite new songs.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Josh Abbott

    Anon 1:19: I know I'm gonna catch shit for this and am just opening myself to criticism but I heard about today's blog and saw that you wanted an artist's perspective so I'll give it a shot:

    There are very few people who can achieve radio success without an actual promoter. I'm not sure why but that's just the way it is. Trust me, we thought seriously about self-promoting after "Taste" did well for us. But after many respected radio people said that's a bad idea, we coughed up the money for a promoter. Is it expensive? Yeah kind of, especially if you're new or still trying to catch a break. But as an artist what you hope is that the airplay the promoter gets you will lead to 2 things:

    1) exposure to TX music fans in that respective area so that you can book a show there and have a crowd be interested in hearing you and possibly buy merchandise, and:

    2) you'll generate enough sales from itunes and albums at live shows to offset the cost of the promotion. So say you spend $3500 on promotion. Well then that means you just need to sell 3,535 singles of that tune to make it back, right? Wrong. iTunes keeps $.33 for every single. And then your distributor (whoever got it on iTunes) gets a cut. So let's say you go thru cdbaby.com to get your tune on there. They keep 9% of the net ($.66), which is right at $.06. So for every single that sells on itunes thru cdbaby you actually get back $.60, which means you actually gotta sell 5,833 singles to make that money back.

    And that's if you go thru cdbaby. We're fortunate enough to have Thirty Tigers who requires a bigger cut but also provides alot of marketing, thus leading to a bigger volume of sales to make it beneficial for both parties. And of course if you're on a record label you don't see hardly anything.

    So like any business, it takes some investing to get it off the ground. You have to hope that your tune is solid enough to generate requests and the favor of the program directors. The radio people mean well and they want to play our songs but a lot of times it's not up to them. And trust me, just because you have a radio promoter doesn't guarantee success. They have to bust their ass making sure it gets reported and peaks as high as possible. Like any business it's not perfect but we all should be so thankful for the radio play that is here only because of the roads that were paved by hard workers like Pat, Cory, CCR, and so many more.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Pudding did Angela have you come defend her? So cute. It's all good buddy.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Ummm, Rita….I don't think that was the kind of corndog she was talking about.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    Josh – Regardless of what people say now that you have posted, thank you for coming on here and giving your opinion. It was asked that artists come on and say something, and you did it.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    "Josh" sounds suspiciously like troll talk.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    TP

    Troll Talk?

    Explain. Sounds like a pretty specific answer to the request to me.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    TP: Yes he answered the request, but I know Josh and he's never sounded that smart in his life.

    Troll talk = Angela Lampton (his promoter)

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    TP

    Rita,

    You can certainly help. For one thing, when we present these artists, you can go support them. Take a serious look beyond the normal (and I am not saying you don't by the way) bands and support something if you like it.

    Adopt-a-band of you will. 8)

    Honestly, the sticking with these guys through the shitty gigs at Sonic-converted-to-bar with 18 people and then seeing them play the Opry is pretty freaking gratifying.

    Being there in the early days is fun. You get to know them in a way that most people can't once they start to really break. It is a fun ride.

    Like playing the lotto I guess. Only better odds. ha

    I always try to give all the bands as much attention as I can (and admittedly, I don't have the time I had 10 years ago to go to every show near me), because some of them will eventually take off and they remember who all has been there from the beginning.

    That being said, don't be surprised when I hit you up for some help sometime. And that goes for just about all of you that I know. 8)

    I have been collecting favors for 10 years. It's almost time to cash some in.

    TP

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    TP

    Josh wouldn't let Angela post here under his name. Think about it, he is one of the biggest lightning rods on the blog. Angela would never do that either.

    Seriously, Josh takes alot of crap and sometimes he opens himself up to it, by posting here for example, but at least he isn't doing it anonymously. But he is one of the fastest rising groups we have and he is working hard to do it.

    He is alot smarter than some are giving him credit for. You don't get to where he has by being dumb.

    TP

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Anonymous

    As a radio Dj I've interviewed Josh a few times and was actually very surprised at just how smart he really is….Here's the thing with radio and request, it all depends on the dj on the other end of the line…If they give a damn about the music they will prob try to give it a chance, but if they don't they'll play whatever theyre PD programs for them…I honestly decide who I play or dont by the vibe I get when I meet that artist.If you are a Dickbag to me then why the hell should I help you out???? Just like any other business, and dont kid yourself it is a business, the way you treat people determines how far ya go… So, go ahead and call your request in but only expect a 50/50 chance of it mattering. Oh and what the fuck is everyones problem with Angela? From my time working with her as a Radio DJ/promoter relationship she's been nothing but professional, hard working and all about her artists. Guess I dont see the problem with any of that.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Texican

    Shanada is AWESOME said…
    Damn what exactly has Jerry Audley done to you?
    Met him when I was doing stage help at a benefit at Loose Wheels in Denison……One of the nicest humble guys I have met in this deal, and came on his dime to play for kids…..have went since to see him twice and the same impression….

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Texican

    Oh If any of you guys want to hear some great live music….John D hale Band is playing tonite at Hat Tricks in Lewisville.

  • Reply July 29, 2010

    Disgruntled Listener

    TP what you're doing is great and I wish there were more organizations like yours. I wish I had the time and money I'm sure it takes to do something like that and it's pretty amazing to me in today's society that someone is willing to put so much effort into doing something that doesn't really benefit their own self. I am not connected to the music business in any way but I am very passionate about what I listen to and what I tell my friends about. I would love to be involved in something like that myself if I could afford to but unfortunately I live in the Rio Grande Valley and the music scene down here pretty much consists of Fowler and Creager a couple times a year and Tejano. I commend you sir. That is all.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Anonymous

    Oh my…this is all so confusing. What does PD stand for? So radio DJs won't play songs without bribes from radio promoters or unless the song is called in by a radio promoter? Why can't radio stations just play songs when people request them? Is it that hard? Will they lose that much money? I just don't understand the workings of this. Can someone explain this process to me in 5th grade terms? I'm just a fan and have no idea how any of this works.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Anonymous

    PD is a program director.

    They aren't bribed it's just the buddy system.

    Example: promoter works a big artist like a Pat along with some B and C listers. Promoter tells PD if you play my C listers song I will get my A lister to do your charity gig, yada yada.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Wolfman Jack

    DJ's today are not real DJ's. They push buttons. Retarded Monkeys can do their job.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Anonymous

    The cause of every artists' problem would be the fact that the majority of the stations are owned by huge corporations that don't live in your town. Think clearchannel and cumulus. They have a formula and know what they want on their stations across the country. The DJs aesthete to collect a check, be a local personality, and help sell ads. They have no real input on what is played. That comes from corporate. There are exceptions but that's about the bare bones truth.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    KS Music Fan

    I have a question, how did you find your favorite band in the first place? I am from Kansas and we don't really have any radio play from Red Dirt/TX artists up here. Found Ragweed through listening to Live at Billy Bob's in a Barnes and Noble. Then found other bands through friends I met going to concerts. If I do listen to a radio station it is internet radio; i.e. Pandora. I buy most of my music through iTunes. This is because of cost and I can't find the band's CD in stores in KC. My point is that radio seems like a dying way to find new music and I don't use it.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Anonymous

    I woke up one morning and a band was sleeping on my floor. Been following them ever since.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    give us a break!

    TP who are you fooling? I'm a starving musician and you have never done anything unless there was money involved! If you are sincere, then it wouldn't hurt you to start by giving us artists a break. You solicit your services to us and the prices are ridiculously high. You have ridden on ragweed’s coattails for years and you need to realize we can’t afford to pay like them! So in other words, if you are really sincere, you may want to start with offering your services by giving the new artists a significant break!

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Texharp

    Abbott had a good point. Once you start actually making this a full time job it is a business to you. Like so many other businesses it does require risk and investment to start out. Just plan it right, put your money in the right gambles, and hope someone hears your stuff and comes back for the rest of the album.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Anonymous

    Hey break

    in the same token why not give a struggling photographer a chance? We will usually work for free? We aren't in the inner circle but like up and coming bands we do good work and need the practice and exposure too. Don't point fingers unless you are willing to do the same.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    LTROVILLE

    Radio is not for listening to music, a radio stations main goal is to sell advertisement. They just go through an assortment of 20 songs to hold your attention until the next paid for commercial comes up. And how do they decide what songs are played? They actually have a group of people they poll to see which artist are their favorites. These musically deprived people(pollers), live in the hills of Ten, with only one radio station to listen to. So lets give it up for the Internet stations, and the independent radio stations.

    How much do people listen to the radio anyway? Personally, I can't remember the last time I listened to a radio station. I go to concerts to hear new music, and I usually rock the same CD's in my car at all times.
    Whenever a bunch of us get together, everyone gets out their Ipods. That is how I get to listen to new artist, and decide if I like them or not.

    While I appreciate what the Music chart stands for, I also think that it drives a lot of the competition. But isn't that the way everything is set up, someone has to win, someone has to be on top.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Anonymous

    It's easier to call a venue and try to book a band when you say " this band has had 3 songs top ten on the Texas Music Chart" versus saying "lots of people have their music on their iPods". Trust me.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    TP

    give us a break! said…

    "TP who are you fooling? I'm a starving musician and you have never done anything unless there was money involved!"

    Don't really know what to say to that, as I started out my whole career doing things for free for years. Not weeks or months…YEARS.

    But, I'll bite…

    "You solicit your services to us and the prices are ridiculously high."

    As far as "ridiculously high," tell me what specifically you need, and what specifically I told you I would charge, and then why you consider it to be ridiculously high?

    "You have ridden on ragweed’s coattails for years and you need to realize we can’t afford to pay like them!"

    Ragweeds coattails? Again, I'll bite. Explain please.

    There are TONS of photographers out there who will do it for more or for less than myself. Unless you can tell me specifically why my fee is "ridiculously high" I will assume you are trolling.

    Here is a quiz for you. How much do bands pay me to take live concert shots of them?

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Sarah

    Maybe stop complaining about the crap radio stations and seek out the good ones and support those. Just like you seek out that great artist with all the buzz, seek out those few gems of an independent radio station and listen and support them like you would your favorite artist. Yeah they maybe playing music to sell advertising, but everyone likes to get paid for what they do, right? And as far as ever being called by a promoter and being told "Play this guy and I'll get this other guy to play a show for you", none have ever said anything like that to me, and I work with all of those mentioned in earlier comments. Supporting local music means more than just your favorite bar band.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Shanada

    Todd, please lift your foot…Cody REALLY has to pee.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    TP

    He can wait till the next stop, or else we will never get there.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    Give Us A Break

    Tp- you are right in the middle of the "click" in this music scene. And anyone that trys to help the up & coming bands, you & your click brothers show them the door, then lock it. You said that everyone needs to get together, promote this music and help the young bands. Really ! Then you & your bros ought to encourage the bands and the people that help promote them. Not try to squash them unless they spend money with you.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    TP

    Still no specific answers to anything I asked.

    So what is it you want? You are accusing me of some vague generalities, and I am more than willing to address any perceived wrong doing.

    todd @ purifoy.org is my email address if you want to discuss it, or 972.782.9222 is the studio.

    I have an open door policy, and I would be more than happy to respond to anything specific you can point me to.

    I realize you couldn't answer any of the specific questions I asked of you, so I doubt this one will get answered either:

    Name anyone I have ever been a part of "closing the door on?"

    I was pretty clear in my previous post in an attempt to resolve whatever it is you had a problem with. Yet you don't really seem to want to resolve anything?

    You can't back up anything you are saying because you clearly no very little, if anything about me or how I do business?

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    TP

    Why can't we edit a post by the way? DO I have to register with Blogger to edit my post?

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    give us a break

    In these days and times, when musicians don't make a dime playing in Austin and can barely pay their bands with the amount they get paid for an opening gig, $1000+ is too much to ask for a handful of photos for some promo pics and/or a cd cover.

    The only reason I brought this up was that TP says that he is trying to help up and coming bands that can barely make ends meet, but then when they ask him for photo work, he quotes the above amount. A little hypocrital in my opinion.

    I think I'll pass.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    TP

    Anyone here who is an artist who I have EVER shot can tell you that I don't quote NEAR that amount.

    And in particular no up and coming artist has EVER EVER been quoted anything like that by my studio.

    So as I suspected, you are VERY mis-informed.

    The rate LABELS pay me is another story, and that is their deal, not mine.

    I don't quote $1000 for band photos period.

  • Reply July 30, 2010

    give us a break

    TP you're digging a pretty deep hole there. I'd be mighty careful on defending your quotes in print! Our print states different.

  • Reply July 31, 2010

    Shanada

    Break…You should buck up and say who you are. Then I'm sure the truth will come out.

  • Reply July 31, 2010

    TP

    Look, this is simple. All anyone has to do is call us to find out what we charge for a band shoot.

    What exactly is your agenda here? I gave you my email address and number to clear up whatever it is you have an issue with. I am easy to find.

    But you to continue to try and discount an effort on my part to help some folks out without bothering to go to the source and discuss whatever it is that bothers you.

    That doesn't make sense. Is it some sort of competition type thing? I don't really get it?

    Claiming my photo prices are too high is your prerogative. But extrapolating that into "Todd doesn't do anything without money involved" is quite a leap.

    Taking time to air some beef with me regarding my efforts to offer much needed to support to artists because you think I didn't give you enough of a break on something seems a little petty to me. Especially when you can get that same service from plenty of other people. There are many photographers who would take your band pictures for free most likely.

  • Reply July 31, 2010

    Mozeman

    Not to interrupt the entertaining exchange at hand, but a comment on the original topic:

    As a "DJ" (an anachronism if there ever was one) who is fortunate enough to possess programming control, I find some promo people to be more useful than others. That is, the ones who don't try to push shit bands on me. Lampton and Finlay spring to mind as people who I appreciate for not wasting my time in this manner. And though I can't speak for any other programmer doing Texas music, I will say that for me, music choices are based first on quality, second on activity in my home market, and third on the overall popularity of the act. It has nothing to do with anything any promotion person says about a band. I'm just trying to put on a kickass radio show with integrity, and I'm lucky to be in a position where I don't really need to make compromises, though I realize that's not necessarily true for everyone doing this.

    As far as radio "dying", we seem to be doing pretty well here in Austin, though there are plenty of stations here who shock me at their lack of programming creativity. Call me outdated, but in my mind, a town's radio stations are part of its identity, and to reject radio outright is to give up on a big part of what makes yours worth living in. And where Texas music is concerned, it's also to dump on a major resource for the growth of the scene. There are some really great things being done in Texas music radio, if not in your town, certainly on a stream. From the top down, in my experience, the bands in this scene have NOT given up on radio.

  • Reply July 31, 2010

    give us a break

    Shanada's reply to this topic is the perfect example of who and how this click works.
    Doesn't matter who I am. There are more musicians than I who happen to have been quoted this. And some have paid it. Of course you'd love to know who we were so we can be black balled by "THE CLICK"!

  • Reply July 31, 2010

    Shanada

    There are plenty of great radio stations around – agreed. Break's personal beef with Todd – complete bullshit.

    This "clique" you keep referring to – also bullshit. Perhaps your music is unoriginal, and just plain bad. A $1000 photo shoot isn't going to make you any better. There is no other way to success other than hard work, whether it's done behind the scenes or from the musicians themselves.

  • Reply July 31, 2010

    Anonymous

    It is "clique" you dumb mother fucker!

    I get so tired of hearing these people who think they are entitled to a career. They blame everyone else for their failure.

    If you were any good, you wouldn't be having this argument in the first place.

    So what if you can't afford TP. Find someone else. I doubt the price of a photo shoot is your biggest problem.

  • Reply July 31, 2010

    Anonymous

    I'm not sure that Give Us a Break was blaming TP at all for anything but since TP seemed to be bragging a little by pointing out that he was thinking of helping young artists by raising money to create a 503C non-profit organization which tries to give some of the younger up-and-coming type guys a chance at some things they otherwise couldn't afford, that he would give the same younger up-and-coming type guys a break in the price of his photos. Break didn't ask for free work, just a break since TP sounded so interested in helping up and coming artists, especially the ones who couldn't afford all of the costs that are involved in this. So how would this work? How would a musician become a benefactor of some of these 503C benefits and who would decide how the funds would be used and for what up and coming artists?

  • Reply August 1, 2010

    give us a break

    Well said anonymous 5:36! All bands need photo shots Shanada as you are well aware of that. And why are you even sticking your nose in this? Not everything in this music scene needs to revolve around you. You of all people should never judge or assume anything is unoriginal or bad music. And no personal beef with TP. Just letting him know he could help bands out with his services too. And you’re 100% right Shananda. A $1000 photo shoot wont help us cause we would never ever agree to be gouged that ridiculous amount.
    Unless of course if your work looked half as good as N. Preston!

  • Reply August 1, 2010

    Shanada

    Moat bands are capable of doing their own shots in the early stages of their career. I'm not judging or assuming, just curious why you have to be anon. And you're right, this doesn't involve me, until you start calling someone I care about a liar. Yup, I said it outloud for all the world to hear. I CARE about Todd Purifoy. 

  • Reply August 1, 2010

    TP

    Break, if I quoted you $1000, then email me and we will discuss it. I would GENUINELY like to talk to you about it. I will tell you that over the years, we have tried to find a happy medium for pricing that will be reasonable for the artists, and also allow us to operate.

    In fact, when we do a shoot, you don't even PAY until the photos are delivered AND you are happy with them. We are paid NOTHING up front when doing artist shoots. You are essentially guaranteed to get what you want if you were to decide that you didn't like what we provided for you. And everyone here who I have shot for can vouch for that. I have a lot of money and time UP FRONT on the line each time I do a shoot because of that.

    Right now (and for the last couple of years that I know of), we do photo shoots for less than half of $1000 for independent artists. There is a fee added on if we have to travel to do the shoot, or if it involves an assistant, or for doing the post work assuming someone does not have design services and wants us to help with that.

    We stay busy enough to feel comfortable with our prices. Again, there are plenty of good photographers who can do it for less, and plenty for more. I have to run my business, and it is not a charity. I have a studio with real bills, real overhead, and real employees I have to maintain.

    I donate my services to many causes, and they are not all music related. I contribute services to Make-A-Wish as the local photographer on a regular basis. I donate shoots to more charity auctions or fund raisers than I knew existed. I donate prints to just about any auction or fund raiser that ask me. I donate my services and my time to every benefit (music related or not) that I can physically do. So your claims that I don't do anything that doesn't involve money is completely false, and THAT is where I take offense.

    I really don't care what you think about the prices of my services. I can't please everyone, and my clients seem happy with my service and work.

  • Reply August 1, 2010

    TP

    My intent was not to "brag." My intent was to answer Katie who asked "What do we do about it?"

    I explained an effort to do something about it. Are we going to solve all the problems people face? No. We are just trying to help in a way that will hopefully grow to be able to help more. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. So far it has served its purpose though.

    How much of a contribution is it? Not sure, but I know it is SOME contribution, and it has made a difference for some people.

    The program I am involved with is not related to my personal business. I am merely a participant, and not the sole decision maker in any way. The people (again not all music industry folks) who support and do the legwork for the effort collectively discuss who/when/where we can help. Some people need things we can't provide. Some fit right into the resources we have to operate with.

    Right now, we are very early in this program and we have helped a few artists (not all "OKOM by the way"). We are NOT raising money and redistributing it to artists who need it. We have a set of resources built on relationships with music industry folks such as producers, videographers, directors, promoters, radio, engineers, studios, booking agents etc… We help when we can.

    We can't help everyone, and that is not what we are trying to do. We are helping a few at a time who we believe we can make a difference for.

    We are NOT a bank, and we are not raising money for artists. "Money" is not necessarily the resource we are trying to provide.

    We are trying to provide opportunity, resources, connections to people who can give advice, support etc. As things progress, we hope to someday be at a point where we can help more people at a time. We are simply pooling resources to help in the effort. As new resources become available, then we have new opportunities to help an artist out. We hope that as an artist gets rolling to the point where they are seeing some success, that they will turn around and give back to the program in some way as well. They will perpetuate the system by helping out younger artists when they can. Yes, it is a very "perfect world scenario" but hopefully we can choose artists who we genuinely believe would be those kind of people.

    There is not set criteria for who we will work with. And there is not any formal "application" process.

    All of us have other jobs/businesses/careers that we have to maintain to support ourselves, so we are not able to do everything for everyone, as it is simply a matter of time and resources.

    I am not saying we have the perfect answer for everyone. We are making a conscious effort to help some people out though.

    todd @ purifoy.org is my email address if anyone seriously wants to discuss it or talk about what we hope to accomplish.

    This probably isn't the forum for it, but anyone is welcome to contact me at any time to discuss any of it.

  • Reply August 1, 2010

    Anonymous

    You get what you pay for. Todd is the best out there. Why else do you think his work is so popular? You aren't anyone in this scene unless you have a picture taken at his barn.

  • Reply August 1, 2010

    Anonymous

    Or Hunter. Hahahahahahahahahaha!

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